New Tank not Setteling

[modilly84]

Hello I am new to fish tanks. So for Christmas i received at 5 gallon corner marineland eclipse tank. I got gravel (cleaned it first with just tap water), then added some decorations also cleaned like previously stated. I will admit i started out with like 9 zebra danios in the small tank and the ammonia skyrocketed straight to 8 ppm (the highest my test kit will read) So then i got rid of all but 3 of the fish. The tanks ammonia still wouldn't go down and i never saw the nitrates or nitrites spike at all. Then 2 of the fish died so that left we with just 1. Throughout all this I've been doing small water changes every 2-3 days only doing about a 10-20% change each time and then conditioning the water so it has 0 ammonia, chloramines, and chlorine. So the ammonia was staying at around 1-2 ppm but has never gone down completely and still no nitrate or nitrite spikes so i know the bacteria for removing ammonia hasn't grown. I also added a orange fire tetra then apparently the fish had fin rot and it killed the last zebra danio and the tetra looks aweful. I don't know what to do anymore since i have tried almost everything except the fishless cycle. Is it possible the bio wheel is bad or i'm doing something terribly wrong. I have had the tank up and running for almost 4 months now and it is really frustrating. Any help would be great and thanks in advance.

[Jay]

Hey modilly84... Welcome to the forum

Sorry to hear about your trouble. It would help us help you if you could post a complete set of tank parameters including pH, GH, KH, Ammonia, Nitrates, Nitrites.

What test kit are you using?

What chemicals are you adding to the tank?

What is your water source is...well - city water etc.

Will wait to hear back.

[modilly84]

I use tap water with water conditioner(API Stress Coat+).

The ammonia is at 2 ppm (10% water change 2 days ago)

Nitrate and nitrite are at 0

Test kit i use is the API fresh water test kit

not sure what the KH or GH is but if its chlorine and chloramines then the last time i had it tested at a fish store it was at 0.

PH level is at 6 (read not to add a PH increase till the tank is cycled)

Let me know if there's more information that you would need.

thank you

[ZeroSystem]

Is API Stress Coat+ the only chemical you're adding to your tank? You mentioned that you conditioned the water so that it has 0 Ammonia, chloramines and chlorine, so I was just wondering if you were using an 'Ammo-Lock' type product to stop the ammonia levels from getting too high? I think that doing so might make you never get the ammonia levels to spike, like they're suppose to, in order to trigger the beneficial bacteria's to start to grow. This is why fishless cycling is preferred, since no fish have to under-go such a dangerous process. Anyways this is just a guess really, but I thought it might be worth mentioning.

[modilly84]

yea the stress coat is the only chemical i have been adding. Is it possible that the bio wheel could have gone bad. And the ammonia has gotten as high as 8 ppm. I also used amquel + that removes nitrate and nitrite along with the cholramine and chlorine. but i stopped using that like 2 months ago. I also used some plant food for my live plants, but i wouldn't see why that would affect the cycling of the tink. I'm going to re-do the whole tank at this point since the last fish got sick and died. Is there anything you would recomend as far as what kind of gravel to use and other things like that.

[Judge]

Clean everything really well, watch the fishless cycling video, go to Ace Hardware and get some PURE ammonia (if it suds up when you shake it put it back) no surfactants. Follow the directions in the video and monitor/test water regularly. Do not add anything else. Remember, the less chemicals you add the better. You should not have to add anything after it has cycled with the exception of something to remove the chlorine/chloramine. It takes some patience but cycling is a natural biological function that occurs everywhere in nature so let it work its course and you will have a happy tank with healthy fish.

[Jay]

I think ZeroSystem was on the right track...something is wacky with the water testing. You cannot have fish, food, etc. and have NO nitrate reading. What is the reading for NO3 from the tap.

Amquel + will bind up the ammonia but you will still test positive for ammonium, that appears to be ammonia on the test.

While I feel that bio wheels are an incredibly successful marketing gimmick, the beneficial bacteria will grow elsewhere if the wheel is not working .

I don't want to get technical here but the dechlor product you are using can really cause a newbie problems. It has a problem with chloramines, does not completely neutralize them and actually causes ammonia to be released. The manufacturer actually recommends using it's other product to bind up the ammonia problem. Therefore you are going to get false positive readings for ammonia. <- I hope that makes sense

Now for more wacky test results...with a pH of 6 the truly free ammonia...the toxic stuff, would be almost 0 and would not be fatal to fish.

I would be interested in seeing a test of you tap water.

As long as you are starting from scratch...Cycle without fish and I would find another water conditioner.

[modilly84]

I actually have tested my tap water and it has 2ppm and 0 nitrates and 0 nitrites. I do plan on doing the fishless cyclying as the cycling with fish failed. What brand of water conditioner would you guys recommend for conditioning tap water.

[Jay]

This really sounds like a chloramine issue. I would switch over to a product like Seachem's Prime. I would also cycle the tank using regular household ammonia. Make sure it does not have any detergent, or surfactants added. <- read the label...just a basic house hold dilution.

There are also some testing terms being used that are not quite accurate. Ammonia does not Spike...you add the ammonia to the tank...the same amount at a time. The ammonia should go to 0 in 24 hours if the tank is cycling properly.

Nitrites will increase as the bacteria colony that eats ammonia grows and finally nitrites will go to 0 as the bacteria colony that eats them and produces nitrates grows.

Are you sure you are testing for nitrates properly. It is a pain, requiring lots of shaking and accurate timing, and a long development period before color matching. I am still doubtful that there are no nitrates in the tank or the tap.

[modilly84]

Hmmm well I just tested both my tap water and tank water that curently has no fish but still has plenty of ammonia in it and i don't get any readings of nitrate at all. Now i do live in the city so maybe that has something to do with the nitrates not existing in the tap water. Or my test kit doesn't work. What test kit would you recomend using. Currently I am using the API Master Test Kit for freshwater tanks. Maybe it's garbage like their water conditioner.