Thailand newbie requests help

[jet]

Hi, y'all. Just moved back from Thailand where my guppies thrived in a big bowl of well water. Here, I splurged and got a chlorine zapper; the day after the water is cloudy. No filter. The gups are eating and swimming happily, but upset when I clean the bowl every two days. Am I a candidate for abuse? How can I appease them? How can I keep the eau clear?
Ta muchly for your help.
Jet

[Tommy Gun]

Jet,

Welcome to the forum!

I wanted to start off by saying that you are going to find that most people on this forum are going to adamantly disagree with anyone who keeps fish in a bowl regardless if they are guppies, goldfish, or even betta fish...including myself. Please dont take my next comments as being mean or aggressive since I know it is hard to 'hear' how I am trying to get my points across by simply reading words.

That said, I think that if you want to keep guppies, you really should look into getting yourself a fish tank rather than a bowl. There are many reasons for this and the first that comes to my mind is that a fish tank is going to have a larger opening at the top which creates more surface area for the water, leading to better gas exchange and a healthy increase in the amount of dissolved oxygen in the water which your fish need. With a tank rather than a bowl, you can have the option of putting a filter and a heater in the tank which are both things that your guppies can benifit from immensly. They are definetly better kept in a temperate water of about 75 degrees.

The cloudy water is most likely a symptom of not having enough benificial bacteria in the water to deal with the fishes' wastes. I cannot express how much it would help you to read through these 'sticky' articles about cycling a tank:

http://www.fishtankforums.com/5-fres...-aquarium.html

http://www.fishtankforums.com/5-fres...cycle-how.html

These will better explain what I am trying to point out about the bacteria you need in your tank to not only keep the water healthy for your fish, but also to help keep your water clear.

Other reasons for cloudy water are bacterial blooms and/or algea blooms. Is the cloudyness in your tank more gray/white or it is more of a green cloudyniess? Both of these are usually brought on by having too many nutrients in your water which create an environment in which algea and bacteria can thrive. While I still feel that your problem is a cycling issue, if it turns out that it is not, you can help reduce the nutrients in the water by making sure that you have a proper amount of fish for the size of bowl (or hopefully tank) as well as ensure that you are not over feeding. using a syphon to vaccum out the substrate (if any) in the tank or anything that is on the bottom of the tank/bowl should also be a regular task for you and will help out when trying to keep water clear.

You also should always use a 'chlorine zapper' or dechlorination conditioner with each water change, especially if you are using city water since chlorine is used to sanitize drinking water but can harm fish. Most of these chemicals also have the added benifit of promoting a fish's slime coat production which will help them be less susceptable to problems like Ich and fungus. It shouldnt be any sort of 'splurge' at all in reality.

It would also help you out quite a bit to pick up a test kit that will allow you to monitor Ammonia, NitrIte, and NitrAte levels in your fishes' water. You will understand why after reading those sticky articles about cycling a tank. It is important for you to know what is in your water in these areas since ammonia and nitrItes are toxic in relatively low levels to your fish. NitrAtes are also toxic, but in much higher levels and you can control these levels by doing simple water changes.

Tank/bowl size is also an issue in many cases. Smaller amounts of water are obviously easier to go bad and since there is less water to dillute ammonia, nitrIte and nitrAte levels, things can go bad pretty fast. On the other hand, smaller bodies of water are also usually quicker and easier to fix. This is also why it is important to monitor ammonia, nitrIte, and nitrAte levels (known as your water parameters) so that you can be proactive when things are getting bad, or good for that matter.

I am assuming that you have moved back to the United States from Thailand and so I would suggest looking at a Walmart for a 'kit tank'. I have bought way too many (according to my wife anyways) 10 gallon kit tanks from Walmart for about 30 dollars. These tanks come with almost everything you need to keep your fish healthy. The ones I usually buy come with the tank, a filter, a heater, hood light, and even a net and some samples of dechlorination conditioners and other products that will attempt to help you start a bacteria colony in the tank (the jury is still debating if these bacteria products are 100% effective or not yet). In my opinion, they are the best for people who plan to keep smaller fish like guppies and are a much easier place to create a healthy environment for them. Using a substrate in a tank like this is completely up to you and even if you do decide to use a substrate, you do not need to buy tons of it and even a small amount, for example a half an inch thick, would be sufficient and may help create more area for bacteria to grow.

I hope this helps and like I said, I am not trying to talk down on you or be negative in any way. I think that you will find on this forum that nearly any question you have can be answered and if nobody can help directly, someone will always be able to point you in the right direction to get the information you need!

It is good to meet you and I am looking forward to talking with you more in the future!

[jet]

Hi, Tommy.
Thanks kindly for all the info.
Wow, I thought it would be as easy to care for gups here as it was in the tropics.
My current bowl is about three gallons, and I have been replacing about 1 gallon of water per day, adding "Aqua Control" and "Cycle", the latter of which is said to release good bacteria and eat up ammonia and nitrites; also notes it may initially be cloudy.
I will dutifully hit my local WalMart for a tank (their current stock of fish are all being medicated, which makes me nervous).
Your suggestions and recommendations are much appreciated. Thanks for all your time.

[Tommy Gun]

No problem.

I think that you may have been more lucky with your last fish than there are differences between keeping an aquarium here versus the other side of the world. At least you are on the right track and yes, the "Cycle" product does put some bacteria into your tank, which is what you really want to do, however this is the type of thing that seems like some people really believe in and some people really feel is a waste of time and money. My opinion is that a whole bunch of chemicals and additives are not always needed if things are done correctly in the first place. In my tanks, I only use a dechlor conditioner and the rest is taken care of for me naturally so long as I keep up with my water changes.

I think that you would be much more successful with a 10 gallon tank as well as having the ability to keep a few more fish than you could in a 3 gallon bowl. Even if you want to stick to the three gallon size, there are some nice tanks out there in that size that come completely equipped as well with a filter and a heater as well as a light. I have seen them at walmart and almost all of the LFS in my area.

My opinion about buying fish from Walmart is basically simple, I don't do it. There are many reasons for that but you point out one of them seeing as how they are medicating complete tanks rather than treating just the fish that need it. THey are not really set up with people who completely understand fish in the first place and since they buy fish in bulk and then distribute themselves. So, I just feel that they are not as responsible as a plain old pet store and so I try to stay away from buying fish from them. To be honest, they are not even the cheapest prices either for most fish. That is all just what I feel and I could go more in depth but I will spare you the finer points of my complete opinion on walmart.

[jet]

Hey, Tommy, thanks for the extra tidbits.
When the snow clears, I'll head out for tank shopping. Hopefully, my meagre efforts at water renewal will keep the kids happy in the interim.
Problems at WalMart? Why, there's a better tribal mix of aisle elbowers, Mad Max cart rammers and Hades-trained clerks at my local WalMart than I ever saw on the seedier streets of Bangkok.
Cheers.

[dlee9707]

i've heard bad things about leaky tanks from walmart, person picks up tank, leaks, gets a new one, leaks, gets his cash back. maybe you'll get lucky :P

[jet]

Dear Tommy and DLee and all,
Thanks for your kind info and comments to help me get started. Just wanted to let you know that Samson and Deli3 had three fry, who are now living in a separate tank. I have named them Tommy, Dlee and Forum after you.

[Tommy Gun]

Wow! It is an honor to have one of your fish as my namesake! A little crazy, but still an honor!

I am glad that everything worked out for you! Breeding fish usually means that you are doing a lot of things right and the tank is healthy. Did you go with a larger tank now or are you going to stick with the bowl?

Just be a bit careful as these guppies can multiple by the dozens. It always seems that one they breed for the first time, it is almost a sure bet that it will happen very regularly. If you want to keep some of the fry, I would seperate them from their mom and dad since they will eat them up, which is probrably why you only had three fry from this batch. Also, in the distant future, I would try to swap a few guppies for new ones because you dont want to have your fish end up becoming inbred!

[Irish563]

Originally Posted by jet

Hey, Tommy, thanks for the extra tidbits.
When the snow clears, I'll head out for tank shopping. Hopefully, my meagre efforts at water renewal will keep the kids happy in the interim.
Problems at WalMart? Why, there's a better tribal mix of aisle elbowers, Mad Max cart rammers and Hades-trained clerks at my local WalMart than I ever saw on the seedier streets of Bangkok.
Cheers.

WalMart is the Anitchrist.
Ok, with that being said, tanks and some equipment from Walmart are ok. Fish are treated horrendously and I suggest you never buy from them.
I havent had any problems with their tanks, my sons 29 gallon is coming along great!
Just my opinion though....
Good luck!
Irish

[Tommy Gun]

Originally Posted by Irish563

WalMart is the Anitchrist.
Ok, with that being said, tanks and some equipment from Walmart are ok. Fish are treated horrendously and I suggest you never buy from them.
I havent had any problems with their tanks, my sons 29 gallon is coming along great!
Just my opinion though....
Good luck!
Irish

I could not agree more! I wouldn't buy anthing that is living from walmart unless it is the bacteria solution stuff to unclog a toilet! Their equipment is fine though, from my experience, and I buy a lot of 10 gallon kit tanks and one 55 gallon kit tank from them and never had a problem. It is a good point though to test out any tank with just some plain water in an area that will not get ruined if the tank does leak though. So far, I have been very lucky! (knocks on wood)