Vacuum during cycle

HUKIT · 12-05-2009, 11:28 AM

I have a 55g that has just started to cycle with the ammonia level reaching 0.5ppm so it's time for the first water change but my question is should i vacuum the substrate or just change the water?

Thanks in advance!

Judge · 12-05-2009, 12:29 PM

H Hukit and welcome to FTF. Did you mean a reading of 0.5?? Should be 5.0. Without fish there is no need to do a water change OR vacuum.

HUKIT · 12-05-2009, 12:44 PM

I do have fish so I figured the less stress the better. But yes the ammonia levels are at 0.5ppm. My question was does vacuuming effect the cycle process? Thanks for the welcome!

Judge · 12-05-2009, 08:25 PM

Well I am sure it will have some impact. For the cycle to move right along it needs to be up around 5.0. This is why we never recommend cycling with fish. To get the ammonia high enough to allow the cycle to progress well, it also can and will harm the fish. The waste is what is fueling the ammonia, remove by vacuuming and you will more than likely lower the ammonia.

Mister Sparkle · 04-12-2010, 05:40 PM

Judge knows what he's talking about. Hopefully, my post is not construed as to argue against what he is trying to tell you.

However, if you are dealing with cultured bacteria (i.e. gravel or filter extracted from an established aquarium), 0.5 is nothing to worry about. I've been known to keep a sponge filter or two bubbling in an established aquarium for a couple weeks to speed up the cycling process on new ones. And I've completed a full nitrogen cycle many times without my ammonia levels spiking beyond 1.0 ppm. However, this means a lot more work and patience, and you also have to keep in mind that the nitrite spike is going to occur more quickly and often quite unexpectedly. In all, maintaining a low level of ammonia and/or nitrite is going to reduce predictability in terms of how long your cycle will take.

My best answer to the original question is that bacterial loss due to siphon will be minimal. Every time I've done a fishy cycle, after letting the waste build up for 2-4 days, I do a 20% water change (most of that coming from the gravel) EVERY DAY! The reason for this is that I'd much rather prolong the process for cycling than poison my fish with their own waste. Ironically, I've found that it doesn't tend to make much of a noticeable difference in the time it takes to cycle. The best bacteria should be living in your filter medium anyway. Again, however, I would stress that I wouldn't try to perform a fishy cycle without some sort of established bacterial culture. Not having that, you are really counting on the proper bacteria to just happen upon your aquarium...it'll happen, but it's unpredictable in terms of guessing how soon. It's not fair to do that to your fish, even the cheaper ones. Nor is it fair to burn the crud out of their gills letting the ammonia levels rise to deadly levels.

Since you already have the fish in there, I'd go ahead and tell you to roll up your sleeves and prepare for daily water changes for a little while. If this makes you miserable, chalk it up to experience and make a mental note to use the fishless cycle many of this board's resident experts prefer the next time you set up a new aquarium. Not everyone's going to get the same jollies out of water changes as I do!

Judge · 04-12-2010, 06:21 PM

One more time for you "guys".. Judge, she concurs with the above advice...all opinions are welcomed and in fact appreciated, that's what makes a good conversation and we all can learn! Thanks.

Sharon

Jay · 04-12-2010, 08:24 PM

Hey HUKIT, Welcome friend to our forums

Quote:

One more time for you "guys".. Judge, she concurs with the above advice...all opinions are welcomed and in fact appreciated, that's what makes a good conversation and we all can learn! Thanks.

Sharon

Lol, maybe we should redesign your avatar

Quote:

Since you already have the fish in there, I'd go ahead and tell you to roll up your sleeves and prepare for daily water changes for a little while. If this makes you miserable, chalk it up to experience and make a mental note to use the fish-less cycle many of this board's resident experts prefer the next time you set up a new aquarium. Not everyone going to get the same jollies out of water changes as I do!

Nor I

...welcome to the forums Mister Sparkle!

Well said!!

Mister Sparkle · 04-12-2010, 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Judge

One more time for you "guys".. Judge, she concurs with the above advice...
Sharon

Please forgive me, as I'm new and slightly retarded.

Judge · 04-13-2010, 07:57 AM

No apologies necessary!! I am used to it. Maybe I should change my avatar to..uh, butterflies and daisies! LOL

Uptown193 · 10-29-2010, 01:42 AM

I regret not doing a fish-less cycle because my ammonia level is right about 8.0 on my test card it is showing a dark green color, which is bad, 0 is yellow. Now tonight i did a 40% water change and it seems to went down to about 5.0 a medium green color. I think I will buy a vaccum and so what sparkle said and change water every day and vacuum at every 3-4 days and let the cycle process take longer. At this point i already have the fish in there so I prefer to keep the ammonia level down and cycle longer, I feel bad for the fish. The fish are swimming around and dont seem to be bothered by it but its too high. You guys are 100% right, do a fish-less cycle next time. I might buy some pellets to lower the ammonia, I think I am in the emergency level with my ammonia. I will also feed every other day. I cant believe how much doo doo my fish make, OMG.

Any other suggestions for me?