Newbie with too much ammonia?

[Meely]

Hi Everybody,
I'm new here and new to aquarium keeping and I'm struggling in a big way and need some help. I've been trying to cycle an aquarium and I just can't seem to get the ammonia under any kind of control. I've got a 10 gallon tank with 2 comets, a shubunkin and 2 cory cats and have been fighting this uphill battle since late June (3+months). We started with the comets which were won by my son throwing ping pong balls at colored water in fish bowls. We got the shubunkin within a few days of the comets and before we knew anything about cycling. When the 3 fish started looking distressed we went into the LFS where we were sold a bunch of dip tests, chemicals and such and told that cycling WITH fish was easy. Well, 3 months later I've learned a lot, bought much better reactivating API tests for ammonia, nitrAtes, nitrItes and Ph and upgraded our filter but we're still struggling. I learned quickly that fishy cycling seemed cruel and that the LFS was willing to sell me their water and dispense shaky advice. So we finally gave up on trying to cycle WITH fish and moved the fish to new quarters so the old tank could cycle without death as a byproduct. We've watched the ammonia climb and climb but we never see any trace of nitrItes or nitrAtes. We have a high ammonia base reading from our tap water which may be compounding the problem. It reads about .50 minimum. If I start with a reading of 5ppm of ammonia in the tank in Aqua-Safe conditioned water by the next day it'll climb above 8 even if I don't touch it, don't add more ammonia- nothing- and there are no fish in it, no food, no waste, etc. It's really baffling me. I've read a fair amount online about the cycle and the whole process but nothing I've seen yet addresses the problem of too much ammonia that goes out of control on it's own. I've been using Kent and or Prime in the water in the alternate tank and it seems to keep everything in check reasonably well so I know it isn't faulty testing chemicals... Heeellllpppp!!! Is it possible that the ammonia is just too high and the good bacteria just can't get enough of a foot hold to multiply?

I'm sorry this got so long. I want so much for our fish friends to be happy and healthy! Thank you for hearing me out and I look forward to your advice and any answers y'all might have.

[mark razmandi]

ok first thing is what kind of filtration do you have?

are you sure it 5ppm and not .5ppm out of the tap...if its 5ppm then thats COMPLETELY CRAZY and nothing ive ever heard of

once i learn about your tank a little more i should be able to help

[Judge]

Welcome Meely to FTF. We could use a little more info but 5 fish in a 10 might be a big stretch. What kind of filtration are you using, water changes how often, and how often are you feeding? These all can contribute to higher ammonia levels.

[Meely]

OMGoodness, I'm sorry that my post was confusing! Our tap water reads 0.50ppm (not 5.0- that would be terrible, huh?!?) The filter we had originally was an Aqua-Tech for 5-15 gallon tanks. We upgraded to an Elite Hush 20 (and thus started the cycling process over from scratch) on the advice of the LFS.
I'm wondering- would two 10 gallon tanks be better for the population we have or one 20 gallon? I know I've hated living in cramped apartments and I'd hate to do that to our fish friends.

When I tried cycling the tank the first time around with the Aqua-Tech filter. I was told not to do any water changes and didn't for several weeks. After 3 weeks I did a 20% change. I was feeding them daily and, in retrospect, probably too much and killing them with kindness. Ammonia levels were through the roof and after a month with still no nitrites or nitrates I decided it was too much for the fish to deal with and called it all off. We emptied the tank and prepared for round 2.

Round 2 we did with the new Elite filter, less food, happier fish and bi-weekly water changes of 25% each time.
Ammonia was still wildly out of control 1 month in and the fish were looking pretty miserable. So I started poking around online, read a lot about cycling with fish and thought I just couldn't do it to them again. Then I found fish-less cycling and decided that had to be the way to go!

Round 3. We moved everybody out of the #1 tank and into another (un-cycled) tank so we could do a hopefully more humane, fish-less, cycle on tank #1 but we still can't find any nitrites or nitrates. The fish are much happier- they are in the second tank and we're controlling their ammonia with Kent and almost daily water changes. I'd like to get the first tank cycled so they can move back in and have some good bacteria around them and be healthier- after all they've been through I don't want to make it worse by stressing them out more.
I started round 3 with an ammonia reading of 5.0ppm. Next day, without adding anything it was up over 8ppm and has stayed there for 3 weeks. Nothing else has shown up. The PH went up a tiny bit but that's been it. As I type this, I'm wondering if maybe we didn't get the filter cleaned well enough in between rounds 2 and 3 and that would be the cause?

I've gotten so attached to these little guys and they've put up with so much and been so patient. I'm hopelessly addicted to them but I'm at a loss of what to do next and afraid of doing more harm.
A million thank yous to both of you for getting back to me so fast! I really appreciate it so much!!!