My Mollies are dying!

[rpowers]

The faq demands a lot of detail, so here it is!

I'm in the process of cycling a 10g brackish tank for mollies.

I started it 2 weeks ago with 2 dalmatian mollies, gravel and a few rocks, etc., plus an Aqueon filter (which claims to have a super-duper 3rd stage that promotes good bacteria, but I'm skeptical). I grudgingly went with plastic plants over the real thing: I wanted the fish to have places to hide without increasing the bioload. I set the heater at 79degrees, put in 3T. of aquarium salt (as recommended by the sales person), and 10ml of Stress-Coat.

For the first 5 days they did beautifully. Lots of playful swimming and fascinating mating behavior (I think the female is pregnant as a result). Then things went bad: they stopped swimming, seemed listless, and had clamped fins. I ran out and bought a test kit and checked levels: pH and alkalinity were on the high end, but I had been reading that this was actually good for mollies. Ammonia didn't register. Nitrates didn't register. But Nitrite was *through the roof*. I did an immediate water change (1/2 tank), tested again, and saw some improvement in my nitrite levels.

The next morning the nitrite levels were back up to 5 or 6 on the test strip (with a big "DANGER" label on the chart), so I did another water change, added a tablespoon of salt, and started trying to read up on what was going on. I kept reading that Mollies like a brackish tank, so I slowly added aquarium salt--maybe two T. a day--never getting the specific gravity over 1.002. I've kept it there.

I test twice a day, and the nitrite levels seem to be stabilizing at "1.0" on the chart: much better, but far from zero. Throughout all of this, my ammonia and nitrate levels have been totally flat, and my water has stayed hard. I've been giving them doses of stress coat with each water change. I bought a bit of filter sponge, cut out a small rectangle, and placed it on top of the 3rd stage of the pump where it can stay nice and wet but not inhibit the normal flow of water, all in the hopes of giving the bacteria more opportunities to settle in. I've added a bit of Stress-Zyme to jump start things. I suppose that all of this has worked to SOME extent--I'm at 1.0 every day, and have never made it back up to 6.

But the fish still look miserable. They haven't clamped their fins since I got the nitrite levels down from the "DANGER" level, but it doesn't look good: they tend to just hang out wherever the pump's current sends them, and they do very little looking around. The male was hanging in there for a while, and the female seemed to be in the worst shape, but in the past 36 hours he has had trouble keeping himself horizontal: whenever I look at him he is either lying on the bottom of the tank in a corner, or standing on his head while he drifts through the water. When he relaxes and stops swimming his tail immediately goes up (he must be exhausted). The female can keep herself upright, but is just staying as close to the heater as she can. An hour ago she drifted into the pump intake (about an inch from the heater), and got a side fin stuck. Both of them started out as vigorous eaters, but now they barely notice the food. Not surprisingly, in the first few days these guys did nothing but poop, and now nothing. They are doing an unbelievable amount of gasping. Never at the surface, just as they lie on the bottom of the tank. My filter seems to be working, though: there are tiny bubbles in the water at the output, you can hear the water filtering and trickling, and see it moving through the filter. So I'm assuming that the water is oxygenated. Also, about 6 or 7 days ago I put in two small live plants. The two fish nibbled at the plants a bit, but nothing since.

And the last thing: today I bought two new Dalmation Mollies. I don't relish hurting living creatures, but I thought that (1) seeing how healthy fish responded to the tank it its present state would be helpful, and (2) I had a weak hope that the greater numbers would help lower stress levels, mollies being community fish. Well, 10 minutes ago my husband called me to the tank and showed me that my original female molly was dead. While there I noticed that one of my new fish has the shimmies. I've never seen it before, but it's pretty unmistakeable. I just took a reading:
Ammonia: 0
Nitrate: 0 (but for the first time seems a bit pinkish, so maybe levels are on their way up)
Nitrite: 2.0
Total Hardness: 300
Total Alkalinity: 120
pH: 7.8

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated!

[somerton16]

ok no need to panic this is very common with new fish owners. how long was the tank set up before you added fish. it seems to me that you didnt let the tank cycle before you added fish. the gasping at the top of the water and lifeless of the fish seems to be nitrite poisoning. the is a good video tutorial of the nitrogen cycle in the library section here. untill your tank gets established i would do a 20% water change untill your ammonia and nitrite readings reach 0 i would highly suggest getting rid of the test strips and get a liquid test kit for more accurate readings. just keep doing 20% water changes daily and stay away for adding too much salt or other chemicals to the tank and just let naature take it course. good luck and keep us posted and dont get discouraged.

[rpowers]

I really appreciate your advice!

I woke up this morning expecting to find that my original male molly--the one floating upside down--had died, but he seemed a bit better. I also found that one of my new mollies had given birth! About 18 fry! Who knew that she was pregnant? Man, they are *cute*!

Anyway, I went to the store and bought some SeaChem and supplies for the fry. I separated out the fry, checked the nitrite level (3.0), and then I did a BIG water change: about 75%. When I left the tank everything looked great, and all of the fish (fry & adult) were swimming and eating.

When I started this I had zero interest in breeding--and I certainly wouldn't have attempted it intentionally while cycling--but now that the babies are here I'm pretty excited.

And I'll say it again: man, those fry are cute!

[louistheloach]

check your ammonia test kit to make sure it is not expired. I highly doubt you would go from zero of everything to a reading of 6ppm without showing any ammonia.

I have heard that mollies have a tendency toward "shimmies" Something to do with so much inbreeding....don't know if that is true....just like you see a fair amount of deformities in danios.....maybe there are other breeds like that too.

I hope the next time you decide to start a new tank, you take a look at fishless cycling......much nicer to watch than to see fish suffer.

ltl

[rpowers]

You are right: the ammonia thing *is* strange. I'm using a brand new dip test, AND I have a continuous indicator that is stuck to the inside of the tank. Neither have registered the slightest bit of ammonia. I can't explain it, but I will pick up an actual drops-in-the-test-tube test tomorrow and check it.

I lovingly tended an aquarium for over ten years when I was a kid, so I knew to watch out for the ammonia. But that was so long ago that I might as well be a newbie: I'd never heard of tankless cycling before. When I was last caring for fish the common wisdom was that water changes were bad: the older, more conditioned the water was, the better! So things have changed in 20 years.

I'll do the tankless cycling next time. Honestly, I really do take the well-being of the fish seriously, which is why I started with only two. My surprise delivery contained 18 fry, and now I'm down to 16. My husband watched me obsessively researching causes and cures online and said, "I know it's a bummer, but they're _fish_." But it's upsetting to think that I didn't provide a healthy enough atmosphere for them to survive.

[rpowers]

Also, an update: yesterday I did a huge water change and used some SeaChem. When I woke up this morning my nitrites were at 0.25 (much better than 5.0!) and the fish were perky. By this afternoon the nitrites measured 0.5. So I'm still getting fluctuations in nitrite levels, but they aren't violent swings to fatal levels. Perhaps the good bacteria are starting to multiply. I did another 25% water change, and added a small amount of SeaChem.

I've lost two of the fry. But the molly that wasn't able to stay upright is doing *much* better, and the molly that had the shimmies has stopped shaking. The four adults seem to be getting along, everyone is active and curious about their surroundings for the first time in days, and their appetites have skyrocketed.