2 questions: about cycling and fish diseases...

Edicson · 07-03-2009, 02:42 PM

ok, so im cycling a 1 gallon betta tank. in it i put 3 zebra danios, 1 relugar and 2 L. zebra danios, dont know what L stands for for they are way bigger than the other danio. Now the first question is...If i overstock a tank(i did it so that i could get ammonia in the tank faster) but if i leave it overstock, would it ever be able to remove all the ammonia? or would there be traces of ammonia and nitrite even after it cycles due to overstock?

second question? the 2 L zebra danios have spots on them, it looks like ich. Now the question is, how do i know if it is ich or it is just due to the high ammonia and nitrite levels?

on my other tank the 10g one, before i learned about tank cycle, i noticed that the fish i had in it had the same spots and it was because of the high ammonia levels, what i dont want to do is introduce the small zebra danio, who looks fine, into the 10g tank and spread ich all over my tank. by the way took him out of the 1g tank and just put him in a small container by himself. so in the 1gallon there is only the 2 L. zebra danios by themselves. Thank you.

Judge · 07-03-2009, 09:10 PM

Well, sorry Edicson, first thing, there is no "if" your 1 gallon is overstocked. It is. Second, if you wanted to really jump start and get it going why didn't you use pure ammonia? That way no fish are harmed. If you are seeing white spots could be ich. Do you have a quarantine tank? You take a big chance if you remove any of them to your 10 gallon.

Edicson · 07-04-2009, 05:55 AM

no i dont have a quarantine tank. i'll probably just keep them in the tank for now or a separate container or something. ok, so the tank is overstock, now does a tank fully cycle been overstock, or would it always have readings of ammonia and nitrite?

louistheloach · 07-04-2009, 10:33 AM

Edicson,

There are a few problems with your choice of action.....there were also other alternatives to cycling your new tank that would have been safer and faster.

Since you have an already established tank, you could have thrown some gravel or put the used filter media from your established tank into the new tank that you want to establish. that would have introduced all the bio media you would have needed to truly jumpstart the new cycle.

When you expose fish to those kinds of poisons, you can cause damage to the fish that causes them to suffer and possibly die (very likely on the second issue) and you open the high potential of causing damage to their system that will leave them more vulnerable to disease and health issues in the future...please consider this the next time you decide to cycle the tank. The route that you chose will actually take much longer than if you had either used ammonia by itself or even faster is to use ammonia plus adding bio material from your established tank (2-3 weeks, tops for the second option). Now since you are over stocked and your ammonia levels will stay higher, you will probably extend the time due to so many water changes that will be necessary to keep the fish alive with minimal damage.......but the answer to you last question is "yes" even the overstocked tank will eventually cycle and will produce enough bacteria through the whole cycle to get zero readings in ammonia and nitrites......but at what cost.

ltl

Edicson · 07-04-2009, 10:39 PM

truely i didnt know that i could do that, cycle wthout the fish. next time that is what i will do.
another question regarding the cycling issue. im going to upgrade to most likely a 20g(wanted to go with 29g but space doesnt allow it). when i bring this tank in, i wont be able to have both tank set up because the 20 is going to replace the 10(again i am very limited on space). now if i take all the gravel from the 10, the filter, decoration and water, basically everthing that is in the 10 and put it in the 20g. how long would it take for the tank to cycle? or would it be immediatly cycle since all the bacteria from the first tank is going in it?
im planning on using two filters for this tank, the one that comes withh the kit, i am not sure of the capacity, and the one that i have now which has a capacity of 5g-20g. would this be fine?
i want to get more water circulation.they told me its find at the petshop, but i dont trust them that much.

Judge · 07-05-2009, 10:02 AM

Don't feel bad, we are all here to learn.

As far as upgrading, once this tank has finished it's cycle ( I forgot to ask about testing equipment, and daily monitoring) and you are ready to upgrade, you might have mini cycle, but nothing to really worry about. Sure thing, as far as the filters. Just keep in m ind that some fish like things a bit more calm.

Edicson · 07-05-2009, 11:02 AM

i use liquid test kits for ammonia, nitrite, nitrate and ph.
the 10g tank has finished its cycle. dont know if you meant when the new 20g tank finishes or the old 10g finish i would have mini cycle.
what is a mini-cycle?

Judge · 07-05-2009, 11:07 AM

I was referring to the 20 gallon upgrade. If you use all of the existing stuff from the already cycled 10 gallon, then you might have a mini cycle, which just means that there would be an almost undetectable cycle. Nothing to worry about.

Edicson · 07-05-2009, 09:49 PM

that sounds perfect. thanks.
how long should i keep a fish isolated for. I'm talking about the fish that a gave the scenario in my first post, where the other two started getting spots, but he looked fine. i isolated him, its been 2 days. i dont know how long i should keep him there before returning him to my 10g. but i dont want to introduce any disease.
He looks stressed out, every time i get anywhere near, he swims all over the place, and he hasnt eaten.
what should i do?