Red discoloration on Goldfish

[spencypoo1]

So I notice today for the first time, my Moor goldfish has a scaly sort of discoloration at the back end where his tail starts. I have never seen this condition on a fish before and was wondering if i should be worried for its health. so far no behavior changes are noticeable. but things have a tendency to sneak up and i didn't want any surprises. i tried including a picture for viewing, hopefully someone has seen texture like this.

My water parameters:

Nitrate around 20
no nitrite
about 150 water hardness
no chlorine
alkalinity is in the 40-50 range which shows to be too low. i don't recall having this low before.
and ph shows about 7.8

is this an alkaline problem? i haven't treated this tank with anything other than Prime Conditioner during weekly water changes.

Thanks for any help.
Spencer

[spencypoo1]

One more blurb... I am seeing a lot of mention of high ammonia levels (or ammonia burn) for the cause of this coloration on the skin. However, isn't Prime Conditioner lowering ammonia levels?

Thanks!

[gregpape23]

What is your ammonia reading?
I don't think you would want something to lower ammonia levels, if your tank was cycled properly, then your ammonia should be taken care of w/o the use of chemicals.

[Jay]

Hey Spencer

I cannot tell from the pic if there is a problem or not.

It is not an alkalinity problem....

alkalinity is in the 40-50 range which shows to be too low. i don't recall having this low before.

Actually the term alkalinity as it refers to aquarium water is very misleading. It really has nothing to do with alkalinity as it is the specific measurement of carbonates and bicarbonates in the water. KH carbonate hardness from the German dKH degrees carbonate hardness.

about 150 water hardness

The other misleading term in our hobby. What we are measuring is called general hardness (GH) from the German dGH degrees general hardness. The measurement (test) is expressed in terms of Calcium Carbonates, in reality a measure of the amount of Calcium in the water. The more Ca in the water the "harder" it gets.

The incredibly technical term "hardness" comes from the ability to produce "lather from soap" the harder the water the less "Soap Suds" can be produced when washing your hands.

We also know that a part of GH is magnesium Mg. The test for GH does not measure Mg or the other electrolytes in the water.

These trace minerals are essential for fish health (proper cell functions). If RO water is used, without restoring the GH with Ca Mg and the essential trace minerals, fish are going to suffer.

Your KH of 50 or 2.7 dKH is a little low 4 dKH would be a little safer
Your GH of 150 or 8 dGH is OK you have "soft" water...But It also says that Ca levels are low and therefore Mg may be very low and essential trace minerals still lower.

You might want to bring your NO3 down a bit by water changes as it can eat up your GH which in turn will lower your KH.

Prime is an EXCELLENT water conditioner. I would not change my water without it.

I'm sorry for the ramble but new hobbyist very often overlook the importance of the pH GH KH relationship especially the impact on fish health of GH. There is more to water quality than no ammonia and low nitrates.

Jay

[gregpape23]

Originally Posted by Jay

The incredibly technical term "hardness" comes from the ability to produce "lather from soap" the harder the water the less "Soap Suds" can be produced when washing your hands.

That is by far the coolest thing I've read today.

[spencypoo1]

Thanks folks! Much apologies for the blurred pic of my Moor. The red coloring is something new for him considering he was strictly a nice shiny gold before... since then, it seems it has spread more on his tail and top fin on his back. still i see no change in behavior, as if he's not effected by it. But still it is hard to tell if it's a harmful sign.
My water has always been store bought in the jugs. Which, talking to the LFS, has explained the soft water. And my 10 gallon I have been using Replenish at water changes, to maintain GH along with Prime in both tanks. However I have not been using Replenish in the 18 gallon tank in question. Prime has always shown good results in my tanks. Would it be a safe maneuver to start treating the larger tank with Replenish as well? Thanks for all the help!

[spencypoo1]

aaaanddd now it's gone. WHHHHAAAATTT TTTHHE?

[gregpape23]

Originally Posted by spencypoo1

aaaanddd now it's gone. WHHHHAAAATTT TTTHHE?

Haha, that goes with the mysterious algae stuff that we were trying to figure out in the other thread lol.

[louistheloach]

One of many mysteries encountered in fish keeping.......

ltl