Big decisions....want your input

Tommy Gun · 10-22-2006, 02:06 AM

Ok, so in my 90 gallon tank, I have the fish listed below in my SW tank and to be honest, they are great fish during feeding time and for showing off to people who do not get to see SW tanks alot, but otherwise, this tank can be pretty darn dull and boring. So, I am thinking of some new options....

My lionfish is severly addicted to live foods and even after a 5 day starving, he will not even glance and food that is not alive. I have even tried feeding him thawed out silversides on a clear stick, trying to mimic a live fish and had no luck. He will however suck up three to four rosy red minnows in one day and is growing very fast.

My puffer fish, at one time always out and about (pre-lionfish and eel as tankmates) trying to get our attention, is now completely reclusive and a very good camoflage artist which is stressful on me since I can hardly ever find him. He is willing and ready to take any food I have to offer including the same live feeder fish and thawed out Krill.

My snowflake moray eel is a great sight and worth every penny I spent and spend on food and what not for him, but if I didnt put him in there myself, I would never know he was there! I have also seen today, for the first time, a full grown specimen and all I can say is WOW! If he is knocking over my live rock now, he will break my tank when he gets to full size unless I super glue every rock to four or five other ones.

So, I took a trip today down to my most favorite LFS. It is a huge, fish only store, with over 1000 tanks and at least 200 saltwater tanks. I talked to the guy who I bought my tank and equipment from (he is a marine biology student) and asked about some options as far as getting my tank a little more colorful and active. His suggestion was to trade in my snowflake eel (as a minimum) and get myself either a bi-colored angel or a medium yellow tang. I really like this idea as it would bring a lot of color to the tank that has a black background (the bi-color angel is yellow and blue). As a somewhat added bonus to trading in the eel, I would be able to actually keep my turbo snails alive and not a five dollar midnight snack to help me get through these algea phases.

I am also starting to think of reducing the high waste loads of my currently three preditors by also trading in my lionfish. First reason, I can get 50 percent retail value, which at his size is almost 30 dollars (I paid a little less than twenty just a couple of weeks ago. I said he is growing fast). Second reason, this not only reduces the amount of wastes in the tank a little, it also gets me out of the live food predicament of having to keep two 10 gallon tanks for rosy red minnows (one for quarenteen, one for feeding) which I can just barely keep up with. Lastly, I have seen on multiple occasions this lionfish 'going after' my puffer fish which I believe is having at least some part in the puffer's new reclusive nature.

The puffer fish however, is here to stay as this is my wife's fish and my children's most favorite fish (it was their decision as to whether or not we trade him in and start a community tank, or keep him and go with preditors. I realize this sounds rediculous, but for those of you who are not married or have kids, you will someday find out how much influence you really have over things like this...nil). Today I also got to see an almost full grown puffer and am really looking forward to keeping this one until it is that size.

So, I guess I wanted to sort of 'poll' you guys in order to get some opinions on these decisions. I could obviously keep things the same, but I cannot get any more fish on top of the ones I have. Keep in mind that I really like to keep 'busy' or active tanks (I keep cichlids basically so that I can overstock and watch all the going ons all day) and the most common suggestion I get when people see my tank is that "it just needs a little color). Also keep in mind that I am not really confident enough to start keeping corals and my puffer fish is not going to be very compatable in a reef tank.

So, let me know what you all think. This is not going to be a snap decision and I will research and fish or ideas you may have before I go doing anything drastic. Thanks again for all your help and insight!

P.S. I am still looking for information on keeping a Cherry Stone Clam in my tank. Check out this thread I started a while ago on the subject. It is really quite an amazing story:

http://www.fishtankforums.com/6-salt...-lives-my.html

ahill3780 · 10-22-2006, 03:08 AM

Hey Tommy,

I think that trading out the Lionfish and the Snowflake sounds like a fine idea in this case. Getting a more active fish in the tank to add some personality will do wonders I think. My tank got a lot more interesting after I added Dorie in.

An Angel would be cool, but do your homework on them first. Angels are coral nippers so you will be limited with one in the tank if you decide to go reef later on. And some need a tank larger than 90g when grown.

A Tang (Sugeonfish) would be a great choice for your size tank as well and would add a splash of color. If you look into these guys I would check out all your options before settling on the Yellow tang. They do have a lot of personailty though and are fun to watch.

Some Triggerfish are colorful and I think they're pretty cool. I plan to get one one of these days when I get a tank larger than 100 gallons.

Gobies are very interesting fish to watch, especially the sandsifters. Check out the Orangespotted Shrimp Goby, this guy forms a symbiotic relationship with a blind shrimp (alpheid shrimp - Marine Fishes by Scott Michael pg.342) which will dig a whole in the sand that they will both share. Very interesting. Some Gobies tend to jump out of open tanks though.

There are lots of options out there.

HTH,
Aaron

Nookuler · 10-22-2006, 09:02 AM

Tommy,

I'm gonna go with Aaron on the Triggers, they add alot of color. As we all know, I'm fairly new at this, so I really dont know if Triggers and Puffers get along. I cant tell how big E.T. is but I have seen some faily small Triggs. I would also look into Butterfly Fish, they seem to have alot of color as well. That's pretty much all I can think of that would be a good tank mate (as far as size) for your Puffer.

muskie · 10-22-2006, 11:46 AM

even changing your background color to a ocean blue can really lighten up a tank. be carefull with triggers if a reef is your goal, and your hands. some aggressive triggers have been known to take a chunk out of there owners hand. they have a real bite. as i know as well as you, the kids and wife are sure to have there input. but its great to keep them involved in our hobby!!

Tommy Gun · 10-22-2006, 12:29 PM

Muskie, you hit the nail on the head with regards to the wife and kids!

Unfortunately, my tanks background is painted black and I have tried to scrape the paint off, but with very little success. I am afraid to scratch the glass and I am worried that even if I get most of the paint off, I will have some little black streaks left that I cannot hide.

I am currently trying my best to catch the eel. I have decided to go trade in the eel and lionfish and will pick up a bicolor angel fish. Then I will relax a bit and go from there. I do not think that my puffer is going to allow me to go completely reef, but I am going to look into some options that the puffer may not harm.

Tommy Gun · 10-22-2006, 07:21 PM

So, I have gotten my eel and lionfish out of my tank at to the LFS and got almost 75 dollars of store credit for them. I did not pick up any new fish however. I decided to allow my puffer fish some 'alone time' to see if he will become less reclusive. I realize that they do spend a lot of time 'sitting around', but I am worried since now days it just sits around, but in a hiding spot. The LFS I went to has a display SW tank with a big version of my puffer and it is never hiding out, according to them.

So, I am thinking about this stocking list:

8 X Green Chromis - Green Chromis (Chromis viridis)

1 X Flame Angelfish - Flame Angelfish (A) (Centropyge loriculus)

2 X Clownfish - Percula Clownfish - Aquacultured (Amphiprion ocellaris)

1 X Yellow tang - Yellow Tang (Zebrasoma flavescens)
OR
1 X Regal tang - Blue Hippo Tang - Medium (Paracanthurus hepatus)

This is just my 'wish' list right now and I will be working on the research over this week with the hope that I can start adding fish next weekend. I need some good advice on how any of you would go about stocking and acclimating these fish (will the order in which I introduce them matter?). I also need to get a good idea if my tank will be overstocked with this list or if I can get away with it? I believe I would end up with 3 large fish (the puffer, the angelfish, and the tang) and a school of 'top swimming' chromis and the lower dwelling clownfish. I am highly confident in my natural filtration system right now and think I can get quite a few fish without too many water quality issues. I am just wondering if the size of the fish is going to keep me limited here.

Again, I will be doing a lot of research, so I am not looking to 'cheat' here and get you guys to do it for me, but any time you can save me....i would definetly appreciate it!

Salt bitten · 10-23-2006, 02:48 AM

Tommy,

I'm late to the party, but the first thing that popped in my head was a CLOWN TRIGGER! I have been doing a lot of reading on Triggers, they can be....well.....very very mean, however you have the perfect fish(Porcupine puffer)as a tankmate. The Clown Trigger would add a lot of color and personality to your tank. The Blue lined Trigger is very attractive as well.

Obviously with your selection of a Puffer you have no ambition of a reef tank anyway, a Trigger would be an awesome addition.

The only issue is your tank size. Some of the Trigger Species get huge, in some cases 33" long! The Triggers that I had mentioned may need a larger tank eventually.

I noted your fish selections above, can a Puffer cohabitate with clownfish?

Anyway, I wish you luck with your selections. I'm still stuck in the direction stage.

TommysGirl · 10-23-2006, 09:27 AM

Hey Tommy Gun,

As far as your background goes, have you tried using any chemicals? My tank was given to me with a mirrored background, and much to my hesitation, everyone kept telling me it would be fine. Sure enough, the fish went nuts when we put them in there. I took my tank completely apart (put all the fish and rock in buckets and a big 60 gallon plastic container) and used stripper to get the mirroring stuff off. I scraped and scraped but the mirroring was not coming off, so finally my husband ran up to Lowes to get their ideas. He came home with muratic acid, which I was even more skeptical about! Finally, after no success with stripper, I took an eye dropper and put about five small drops on the back of my tank. I used a paper towel (and rubber gloves) to wipe it around. It completely ate through the crap that had been painted on to the back of my tank. My husband brews his own beer, so he took some of his sanitizer, which has a neutralizing effect, and sprayed off the back of the tank with that. We had taped off the top of the tank too and made sure nothing got in there. Then I took the water hose for about ten minutes and just let it run on the back of the tank, then we set the tank back up and the fish seemed to be completely unaffected-plus they're no longer trying to battle themselves to death! I should also mention that this did not scratch up or harm my tank in any way, that we can see. I don't know what anyone else will have to say about using chemicals like that, but we were VERY careful and I felt it was a better option than my fish all dying from the stress of fighting themselves with the mirror.

Best of luck to you!!

Tommy Gun · 10-23-2006, 04:57 PM

Salt bitten,

I have seen a lot of those clown triggers for sale in my area and I am glad that you brought that up. I am having somewhat of a hard time figuring out if this fish would only be aggressive toward other triggers, or other fish in general. I am getting conflicting information.

I have a few fidderent compatability charts I use to see what types of fish I might be able to stock in my tank (according to 'personalities', not size or any other considerations). All three of them say that a puffer fish is basically compatable with all fish except for some inverts (shrimp) and pseudochromis. I am basically stocking my tank around this puffer and really want to keep him in the tank. I may rethink the smaller clownfish, but I would really like to keep two to three larger fish and a small school of small fish like the green chromis. I have seen these fish at my LFS alot and they almost seem to change colors as they move around! They are also very cheap for SW fish and so I could easily afford 6 to 8 of them.

Tommysgirl,

Thanks for that input! I have also tried some paint strippers but most of them say that they will etch the glass if I try to take the paint off. I think right now, with a little bit of sucking my beer gut in, I could easily fit behind the tank to get the paint off and put on new paint. It is situated in a corner of the living room with a good foot behind it in most parts. I will try to get my hands on some of that acid. How much did you use? I am also worried that I can get most of the paint of, but if there is some small black spots, they will be pretty easy to see when I paint the tank a dark blue. I do not want to go with the traditional blue color I see most of the time but instead what to go with a blue sort of like the darker blue on the background of this website.

TommysGirl · 10-23-2006, 07:45 PM

Hey TommyGun,

We used a couple of paper towels folded up together and lightly poured the muratic acid on it. It was just a little bit-not enough to even soak through the towels or burn your hand. It was odd because the acid sort of ate the mirroring, and when I would pat it on one spot and it would kind of spread out. Once the mirroring appeared gone we got a clean towel and put a little more acid on it to clear the remaining haze off. It worked like magic (and believe me I wish I'd started off with that, instead of an afternoon of paint thinnger and scraping). I don't know what it would do with a thick coat of paint, but you will probably want to lay several newspapers or towels down and have several wiping rags/towels handy. Oh and my husband just said it came in a one gallon bottle and was about $12.00 (can be found in swimming pool stores too I believe). We also took a trashbag and folded it in half and then taped it to the rim of the tank-just for cautions sake. Best of luck with it!

TommysGirl