Thread Algae

[hlsarge]

I have just discovered Thread Algae in my tank that is in the early stages of fishless cycling. My book says it's caused by either too much food or too much light. Since I haven't used any food yet, I assume it's caused by too much light. Light souce is 156 watt T-5 HO (70 gal. planted tank), getting 12+ hours a day. Plants haven't really gotten established completely. Any suggestions?

[ZeroSystem]

Cut back on the photo period. Eight to ten hours of light a day should be enough.

Edit: Ok totally off topic but woah, what happend to my post count? I could've sworn I had more than that! :O

[hlsarge]

My reading leads me to believe that it could be too much iron or other nutients, recommending that I add more plants. My tank doesn't have a lot of plants, they are all new and several are not fast growing. Recommendations, look for fast growing plants and emergent plants.

Recommended plants included:
Indian Fern - Ceratopteris thalictroides
Water Lettuce - Pistia stratiotes
Duck Weed - Lemna minor
Hornwart - Ceratophyllum demersum
Amazon Sword - Echinodorus major and bleheri
Vallisneria spiralis

I have also read that phosphates could also be causing the problem.

Still other reading has implied that the True Actinic light may be contributing.

I'm sure I came across several other possible causes.

There are no fish in this tank yet.

[Tommy Gun]

I am not the plant expert or anything near it, but I think your problem is more centered on the fact that your tank is cycling and not a balanced environment yet. Obviously you don't want to be doing a bunch of water changes to reduce iron or other nutrients in order to address the algae at the expense of the cycling process.

I probably shouldn't go on my memory alone, but I thought I read a post where Jay says it takes about 10 days for the plants to get acclimated and start using nutrients after being placed in a new tank so you might be jumping the gun by running out for new plants right now.

Besides, my gut is telling me that the advice in your book is based upon an already established tank and not one that is cycling still. With that in mind, I would agree with my good friend ZeroSystem as far as turning your lights off a little bit sooner to see if that will help with the algae but not kill your plants. Otherwise, this is probably something I would ask in the planted tank sub-forum.

[hlsarge]

Here's what I have so far.

Set Up 2/16/08 70 Gal Tank

2/16/2008 6:40 PM Added 70 ml Cycle and 40 ml Ammonia
2/16/2008 10:00 PM Measured Ammonia 7.00
2/17/2008 10:00 AM Measured Ammonia 5.00
2/17/2008 7:15 PM Measured NH3 and NO2 5.00 0.00
2/18/2008 8:00 PM Measured NH3 and NO2 4.00 0.25
2/20/2008 7:30 PM Measured NH3, NO2, & NO3 3.00 1.00 10.00
2/20/2008 8:30 PM Added 5 ml Ammonia
2/21/2008 7:30 PM Measured NH3, NO2, & NO3 1.00 2.00 5.00
2/21/2008 7:45 PM Added 20 ml Ammonia
2/22/2008 10:10 PM Measured NH3, NO2, & NO3 0.25 2.00 60.00
2/22/2008 10:30 PM 50% water change + added 30 ml NH3
2/23/2008 8:00 AM Measured NH3 and NO2 2.00 2.00
2/23/2008 9:15 AM Added 30 ml NH3 + 25 ml Cycle
2/24/2008 2:00 PM Measured NH3, NO2, NO3 0.00 1.00 5.00

I thought the Algae problem was best discussed under "Maintenance". The discussion regarding plants as a maintenance weapon against algae by depriving them of the abundance of nutrients. The suggestion was targeted toward new tanks and algae problems. Suggesting that filling it with "weed" species that will grow fast will choke out the algae. Then the excess plants could be removed. I really don't think of this as a discussion about the plants so much as new tank, new substrate equals too many nutrients, equals algea, equals problem. Enter Plants. It didn't make sence to try to move it.

[Tommy Gun]

The difference between your plants and algae, as I understand it, is that the plants can import nutrients from your substrate via their roots where as algae can only import nutrients via the water....so your water is full of nutrients because you continually add them in order to cycle the tank. Based upon an article I read recently - written by a well respected "athority" in the hobby - stated that your problem is likely to be the over abundance of ammonia...specifically ammonium; hence your pickle.

As I said, I am not a plant expert - but I believe that if your plants were just added it may take them some time before they begin competing with the algae and my suggestion was to double check that with someone who is more familiar with plants since they are a relatively rare breed on this forum...however, that is just a suggestion, nothing more, nothing less.

[Jay]

Hey Hlsarge...

IMO I think you nailed it in your first post.

> It has only a few plants and therefore no bio dominance.

> Way too much light at this point, 7-7.5 hours would be fine.

> Lots of Nitrogen around for the Algae

I think you need to treat this as a non planted tank. Cut down on the light and cut back a tad on the NH3 or if you are headed in the fully planted direction, cram it with weeds, add some fish and start a dosing NO3 and PO4 instead of NH3.

Just an aside..Dosing with Seachem Excel in either scenario is going to be net positive for you.


Note to Zero...when we were hacked some of us lost our post count. Mine is missing about 1500.

Regards,
Jay

[hlsarge]

Purchased a test kit for Phosphates and the water (in tank) measured closer to 0.00 than to the first measurable quantity of 0.25

Really bizzar finding however was the change in water hardness. My kH has aways read 10 drops (179 ppm) but is now reading 6 drops (107 ppm). But my gH which has always measured 15 drops (268 ppm) is now reading almost double at 27 drops (438 ppm). Going to try a major water change today to see if the gH comes back to something more normal.

On the Algae problem, which seems to have stablized and getting much better. I replaced the Pure Actinic lamps with 6700k lamps. I cut way back on the hours with lights on. And I've double the plants.

My ammonia today is 0.00, nitrites 1.0 and nitrates 5.0

Wondering if I should continue with the fishless cycle and add more NH3 or start adding fish and transition over to cycling with fish.

[hlsarge]

Planted the new plants which caused much turbidity from Flourite. I did the 90% water change. And moved fish from holding tank to new tank. I feel the ammonia from Walmart with it's "chelating agents" may have been the reason my gH went so high. Will go with cycle by fish method from this point on.