branfrog

The post concerning ADF's and Frozen Blood worms reminded me of my recent bout of ICH.

After cycling my community planted tank, (76 degrees), I added visually healthy neon tetras, a couple ottos, cherry shrimp and an ADF to the tank. Everything went well until 1 month later when i decided to see if my ADF would like some frozen blood worms. The fish loved it! I don't think the frog actually got to eat any.

About 3 days later I spot an ICH dot on the tail fin of a tetra. I waited a couple days to make sure, and indeed it was ICH, and spread to other fish. So began the long process of treating the ICH with raising the salinity and temp of the water. I was successful in getting rid of this disease with just a few plant casualties.

After a quick internet search I found one unsubstantiated page saying frozen foods such as bloodworms can carry ICH. Is this true? I have an entire package of bloodworms in my freezer which will probably be thrown away.

Is it possible for freeze dried bloodworms to carry illnesses? I'm afraid to introduce even these to my water now.

penna32

sorry about reminding you of this =[


http://groups.msn.com/TheBettaObsess...sisforyou.msnw
10th paragraph

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branfrog

hee hee! its ok,

I either read that site or a similar site; its kind of what i meant by unsubstantiated because i don't put much stock in "yahoos" who post there.

It does sounds likely the bloodworms introduced ICH into my tank though. But I fed them only about 1/12th of a cube. I must have won the ICH lottery that day.

penna32

have you made any new additions to your tank? new plants, fish ?

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branfrog

hmm, I did add 2 new mail order plants about 2 weeks before the outbreak. These were soaked for 6 hours in an aluminum sulfate solution prior to being added.

Tommy Gun

I do not believe that your frozen foods could carry ich and in fact, I have never heard any warnings or even a single comment about this being an issue. The only thing I am not 100% sure of is if other illnesses or diseases can be carried in frozen foods, however, I feel it is safe to assume that the flash freezing process is harsh enough to kill anything you would not want to transport to your aquarium(s).

That said, it is VERY important to realize that Ich is not always visible to the naked eye. In fact, other than when it is in the white spot stage of its life cycle, you cannot see it. Because of that, your tank could currently have a population of this parasite right now, even though all of your fish are 'visually healthy'. It is also important to know that your fish can actually fight off an Ich infestation when it is healthy and unstressed, which can be baffling to us when only one or two fish are found to have white spots while the others are not. So, the odds are that in your situation, you either introduced ich to your tank via the plants (especially if you added any water they came with into your tank, but they also could have carried Ich on the plant itself) or new fish/inverts....OR you have had ich in your tank for a quite a while and the fish you found white spots on was stressed or otherwise unhealthy, leaving it vulnerable.

Jay

Tommy is absolutely correct. Ich is introduced into the tank, it does not occur spontaneously. All it takes in one live ich organism at some time on something and an outbreak is possible.

The nature of the organism will not allow it to be frozen and survive so the frozen bloodworm thing is myth and misinformation.

Bacteria however are very capable of surviving freezing, it just slows down their reproduction. Most reputable frozen food companies treat for bacteria.
It is a good idea to read labels.

Jay

branfrog

I contacted San Francisco Bay Brand, (fish food manufacturer), to get an official comment about this topic and it seems Tommy Gun and Jay are correct!

Looks like i won't throw away my $5 pack of bloodworms after all. My fish will be happy!

I was given permission by SFBB to post our e-mail correspondence below, (phone numbers and names have been edited out):

Hello,

I have a question about disease prevention in my freshwater aquarium. There seems to be unsubstantiated reports on aquarium websites that frozen bloodworms can carry and introduce the ICH disease to aquariums. I am not an expert by any means on this topic but I am wondering if it is possible for the ICH organism to survive the freezing process?

I do know that bacteria can survive the freezing process. As San Francisco Bay Brand is a trusted source of high quality aquarium foods, I trust that it is treated for bacteria. Could you briefly describe how this is achieved in bloodworms for my assurance?

Any guidance you could provide me would be very much appreciated!

Thanks,
Branfrog

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Dear Branfrog,

Thank you for your interest in San Francisco Bay Brand. Bloodworms do not carry Ich and we have no knowledge of fish food of any type being linked to Ich. Ich is most often brought into the tank or pond on new fish or plants (not if they are quarantined!). However, it is also believed that some survivors of an Ich infection can become latent carriers, with the parasites forming a latent stage at protected sites such as the base of fins or the gills. Subsequent stress or poor conditions can awaken white spot to re-infect either its host or other fish.

Our bloodworms go thru a several step process that involves Ozone and UV.

Thank you.

Tommy Gun

Oh yee of little faith!!! Thanks for posting the info you got from San Fransisco Bay company!

Jay

I know I feel better Good Research and documentation!

Jay