filter, filters, and more filters ..

AngelLeah1981

I'm terribly confused about filters. I have been thinking sump, overflow, canister, etc etc were filters. Someone gave me the impression that they are not considered filters. I got some really good advice and information but just wanted to post this to make sure I'm not missing anything ...b/c I sure don't feel like I have as firm a grasp on this as all the other stuff. I was told a sump costs $20-30 a year to maintain and a canister costs $20-30 a month to maintain. I want it to be cheaper in the long run. If the sump is cheaper in the long run then I don't mind paying the money for one now. I like to save money. ha ha. Also, I'm being told "get 1 canister...it should be enough by lfs who has algae on their tank and rock looking stuff" and "get 2 canisters by lfs that is trying to sale me everything that was ever made for an aquarium LOL. Well, ACTUALLY they recommend 3 or 4 filters. ..so confused. If I could just figure out the filter thing I would feel so much more confident. Thanks for advice and help.
Angel Leah

firefish lover

Let me get this straight AngelLeah1981 you want to know how much it costs to maintain a filter or how much one costs and which one's to buy? I will straight with your confusion of sump,overflow and canister. a sump and canister can both relate to an overflow because an overflow is just a way of filtering water to either a sump,canister, protein skimmer etc. As far as the feud between which filter to choose from (canister or sump) it is really all a matter of preference between the two. I happen to prefer a sump because it is easier to maintain and not necessarily cheaper but a heck of a lot more effective then a canister filter as far as filtering out the water goes. I think it all depends on what you want to do, what your budget is , and what your prefrence is. As far as your local fish store goes some of them can dish out alot of bull if it make's belive the the expesive models are "better"
Happy fish keeping and remember that if this is no help you can always shoot me a private message

Sincerely, the one and only
Firefish lover

AngelLeah1981

I just want to say the reason why I haven't gotten back to you is because I have been MAJORLY sick. I think I had the flu. I'm starting to feel better today and yesterday. Sorry about that. I am still VERY interested in your advice and opinions. Well at this point I throw my hands in the air. I have been told many times to get a sump so I'm just going to get a sump. I was just trying to save money and was hoping the lfs store that suggested 1 canister filter instead of a sump was right. After I've had time to sit on it and think about it, I realized I want my tank to be crystal clear and her tanks were definatly NOT. They had so much algae....so I decided to get a sump. So right now I am just wondering are all these items considered filters? : sump, canister, rock, overflow, protein skimmer, algae, and mud?

I thought if you had a sump you wouldn't need an overflow? Do you only need ONE overflow?

Thank you so much for your response.

Massey

I will try to help out Firefish here a little.

The Overflow is one way of getting the water out of the tank and into the sump. This is a very effective way to do this but it has its drawbacks. Most overflows run on syphon principals, which is good untill the syphon breaks. If the return pump shuts down then you will lose the syphon, and unless you have some type of device that will reinstate your syphon you will get some flooding when the return pump turns back on. (tanik cleaning and power outages are the most common reasons the pump will shut down). With an Air lift pump (about $15) you can automaticly restart the syphon and live worry free.

Sump. Another tank under or around your tank that acts as a filter. A sump can use mechanical or biological or both methods of filtering. A sump also adds a few gallons to the capacity of the tank making an overall larger tank (larger tanks are easier to care for). Most sumps need a pump to return the water to the tank (sump under the tank) but if the sump is over the tank you will need a pump to put the water into the sump. If you use filter floss and charcoal then you are using mechanical filtration. Most saltwater sumps fall into the category of Refugium. A refugium (fuge for short) uses live rock. live sand, and micro algae to biologically filter the water, this method more closely mimics the real world. Also adding a quality Protien skimmer to a fuge will assist in removing the waste material from the fish and decaying food material. I would recommend the fuge and skimmer for most tanks.

Cannister filter. They are basicly large mechanical filters, that pump water out of the tank filter it with floss, bioballs, charcoal and then send it back into the tank. They do require frequent maintenance and media changes but are a very effective method of filtering your tank. You can even fill most cannister filters with live rock/sand and get some of the bennifits of a fuge out of the cannister. The cannister filter does not usually require an overflow, it usually has a pump or self starting syphon built in.

Depending on out tank size is going to depend on what size sump or cannister you will need. and your return pump should be able to produce 10x the capacity of your tank in GPH. so if you have a 50G tank then you need at least a 500GPH return pump. If your doing a 50G tank with cannisters then you will want a cannister that will be able to filter at least 20% more than your capacity, or get 2 that will add up to more than 20% more than your tank. You dont want to run your filter at full load all the time. You will wear out your equipment and media faster than needed. Example. You again have a 50G tank and want a cannister for it. You see a cannister that will work for up to 50G but at 50G this will be maxxing out the filters capacity and you will be replacing the media constantly (once a week) now buy one rated for up to 75G which is more than 20% greater than your tank and the filter changes are less frequent (every 2 weeks or so). Now you can do 2 cannisters that add up to 20% more. 2 30G max cannister filters will put you at 60G capacity which is exactly 20% of your tank's capacity and you are in buisness. Again replace media every 2 weeks or so.

I hope this helps you out

Nereaga

One thing to add to Massey's great post. One other thing that will determine how big your return pump is, is the size of your overflow's bulkhead and/or drain. The bigger the hole(bulkhead) the bigger the return pumps you will need.

Hope that helps too.

Brad

firefish lover

Instead of going into confusing details i will simply give a definiton for everyting related to filter that is commenly used I will start with your main ones that you posted about
Sump : as the others posted a sump is basically a glass, acrylic, plastic, or fiber glass box that hold's filter media, pumps and the accessional protein skimmer
Canister: a canister filter is generally a box shaped filter that is under the tank or beside it like a sump but gerally there is more media, it is harder to see when media needs changing, and water gerally flows through all layers form top to bottom where it is then returned to the tank
"Rock": This would be live rock or sand that has beneficial invertebrates and organisms that help to control the "nitrate" cycle and alter wastes into forms that are easier to remove
Overflow: overflow is not a type of filter but a form of siphon that delivers water the filter
Protein Skimmer : a protein skimmer is quite simple to use but with a complex theory and process behind it so i will define it in a user friendly form. A protein skimmer is a form of filter that creates a torrent of bubbles which combine protiens and dissolved organics into the bubbels where they are then collected in a collection cup
"algae" : Algae is not a form of filter but it can be used as one because its potential is misunderstood. Algae as must of us here on the forum and in the hobby understand is terribly persistent because it needs very little. Algae is used in a refugium or a turf scrubber ( this is a complex filter that is used only for tanks with many thousands of gallons of water) to absorb nutrients from the tank to stop algae growth in the main tank. In theory algae is used to fight fire with fire or in this case algae with algae
"mud": I can see why this confuses so many people because mud is not really a filter but a filter media that is placed in a refugium to provide algae and microorganism with a home to live in and a place for these organisms to get main nutrients that they need.

Now i will explain the othor main filters and filter media
Power filters: power filter are some of the most commenly used and easist to maintain. It is simply a filter with and inlet and outlet and a filter pad with activated carbon in it
Activated carbon: This form of filter media is used to remove dissolved compound's but in a saltwater or reef aquarium remove nessacery nutrients and compounds that are need by the beneficial organisms so you have to be careful to get reef safe carbon
Bio-balls,ceramic rings,etc.: this filter media is used as a place for beneficial bacteria and organisms to live in

I hope this all helps and if you have any more questions feel free to ask!!

Wishing you the best of luck and a happy holiday
Firefish lover

AngelLeah1981

I'm sorry I am just now replying. I have been without internet for a while. Thank you so much for clearing that all up. I totally understand now. What great detailed answers !!
Angel Leah

Tiff

I find this thread to be vary good information on filters. Thank You for posting it.